INFO-VAX Fri, 23 Feb 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 108 Contents: Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminar (07.02.20) Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Re: F$GETJPI doesn't match SHOW PROCESS/ACCOUNTING Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Oracle DBO/VERIFY error Re: OT: Quebec Health Care Virus Re: OT: Quebec Health Care Virus Re: OT: Quebec Health Care Virus RENAME/QUEUE again Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems Re: Terry Shannon article nominated for Wikipedia deletion Re: Terry Shannon article nominated for Wikipedia deletion Re: Terry Shannon article nominated for Wikipedia deletion Re: TSZ07 Re: TSZ07 Re: VT320 or 420 keypad codes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 23 Feb 2007 12:05:41 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Message-ID: <5483klF1uhq6hU1@mid.individual.net> In article <00A63AA0.0226759F@sendspamhere.org>, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > In article , healyzh@aracnet.com writes: >> >> >>Bob Koehler wrote: >>> In article <00A639DD.F85718F7@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman- >>> @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >>> > >>> > So Kraft Foods should buy OpenVMS! >> >>> You want an OS that tastes like Velveeta? >> >>Wouldn't that be Windows? > > Weendoze would be more like Swiss cheese! Are you sure it's not Limburger? bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 07:47:39 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Message-ID: In article <00A63AA0.0226759F@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > > Weendoze would be more like Swiss cheese! They may both be full of holes, but I like swiss cheese. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 18:09:09 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Message-ID: <548ou5F1vjau5U1@mid.individual.net> In article <00A63AD2.888B1C52@sendspamhere.org>, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > In article <5483klF1uhq6hU1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >> >> >>In article <00A63AA0.0226759F@sendspamhere.org>, >> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >>> In article , healyzh@aracnet.com writes: >>>> >>>> >>>>Bob Koehler wrote: >>>>> In article <00A639DD.F85718F7@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman- >>>>> @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >>>>> > >>>>> > So Kraft Foods should buy OpenVMS! >>>> >>>>> You want an OS that tastes like Velveeta? >>>> >>>>Wouldn't that be Windows? >>> >>> Weendoze would be more like Swiss cheese! >> >>Are you sure it's not Limburger? > > That's a derisive insult of Limburger cheese. Your probably right. Limburger doesn't smell nearly as bad!! bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 13:18:19 -0500 From: Bill Todd Subject: Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Message-ID: Bill Gunshannon wrote: > In article <00A63AD2.888B1C52@sendspamhere.org>, > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >> In article <5483klF1uhq6hU1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >>> >>> In article <00A63AA0.0226759F@sendspamhere.org>, >>> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >>>> In article , healyzh@aracnet.com writes: >>>>> >>>>> Bob Koehler wrote: >>>>>> In article <00A639DD.F85718F7@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman- >>>>>> @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >>>>>>> So Kraft Foods should buy OpenVMS! >>>>>> You want an OS that tastes like Velveeta? >>>>> Wouldn't that be Windows? >>>> Weendoze would be more like Swiss cheese! >>> Are you sure it's not Limburger? >> That's a derisive insult of Limburger cheese. > > Your probably right. Limburger doesn't smell nearly as bad!! Has anyone here ever encountered Tilsiter? My wife and I got some for a picnic in Switzerland once and left it for the squirrels - I've always wondered whether it was just long past its sell-by date or really that bad, but never had any inclination to obtain more to find out. - bill Update: Google (or, actually, Google Scraper) is my friend. Turns out that (according to the dubious expertise of Wikipedia, which was one of the early Google returns) Tilsiter is called Havarti by the Danes, and we *like* Havarti, so I guess we just got a bad package (and I'll have to stop dissing it). ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 06:10:04 -0800 From: "n.rieck@sympatico.ca" Subject: Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminar (07.02.20) Message-ID: <1172239804.279428.175490@z35g2000cwz.googlegroups.com> On Feb 22, 9:56 am, Paul Sture wrote: > In article <1172152081.623208.254...@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com>, > [...snip...] > > BTW, the group photo on the top of this page... > http://www.encompasscanada.com/ > ...looks rather small. I should mention that these people are the ones > who stayed until 17:30 that day. > > I did wonder how many attended? > > Paul Sture- Hide quoted text - > I'm not sure of the official number but would guess between 60 and 75. Does anyone have any attendance numbers for Montreal yesterday? Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge, Ontario, Canada. http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 16:09:46 GMT From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jan-Erik_S=F6derholm?= Subject: Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Message-ID: JF Mezei wrote : > VMS has gained 7 new stock exchanges in the last 18 months, including > Shanghai. As a side note, the scandinadian stock exchange which owns the > OM software had been interviewed on BBC some time ago about whether they > would jump into the stock exchange merger craze, and they said "NO", and > one of the reasons cited was their stock exchange software business > which they were selling to many other stock exchanges. That is "OM Technology", a part of (but not the same part) of OM that also runs the Stockholm exchange (OMX). Now, in the paper "Computer Sweden" (from IDG) that I got in the mail *today* there is an article about OM Technology currently beeing porting it's software to Linux (after closing an effort to port to Windows servers since it never worked good enough). But of course, it's *current* customers are to a large extent running VMS. Regards, Jan-Erik. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 08:43:17 -0800 From: "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" Subject: Re: F$GETJPI doesn't match SHOW PROCESS/ACCOUNTING Message-ID: <1172248995.980665.107890@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> On Feb 22, 7:19 pm, David J Dachtera wrote: > Hhmmm... : > $ jbi = f$getjpi( jpi, "biocnt" ) : > Why don't the Direct I/O and Buffered I/O counts match the values returned by F$GETJPI()? Because you did not ask for those? :-) This topic seems to call for a teasing reply or two. I'll go with: - David has forgotten more about DCL than most programmers ever know, and here is a case in point. my runner up: - Senior moment Dave? Met vriendelijke groeten, Hein. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 02:50:48 -0800 From: "Camiel" Subject: Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Message-ID: <1172227848.363049.45770@s48g2000cws.googlegroups.com> On Feb 23, 1:24 am, David J Dachtera wrote: > Camiel wrote: > > > Oops... I saw that my last reply was a response to a different post > > than the one I replied to. > > > I'm booting OpenVMS 8.3 (7.3 gives a similar message) on an ES40, so > > the hardware I'm trying to emulate should be compatible with the OS. > > > The primary bootstrap, APB.EXE, is found correctly. My emulator runs > > the actual SRM console and PAL code, so I'm not emulating that. The > > complete boot sequence looks like this: > > > AlphaServer ES40 Console V7.2-1, built on Jun 9 2006 at 15:36:48 > > > CPU 0 booting > > > (boot dqa0.0.0.15.0 -flags 0,0) > > block 0 of dqa0.0.0.15.0 is a valid boot block > > reading 1226 blocks from dqa0.0.0.15.0 > > bootstrap code read in > > base = 200000, image_start = 0, image_bytes = 99400(627712) > > initializing HWRPB at 2000 > > initializing page table at 7f56000 > > initializing machine state > > setting affinity to the primary CPU > > jumping to bootstrap code > > %APB-I-FILENOTLOC, Unable to locate SYSBOOT.EXE > > %APB-I-LOADFAIL, Failed to load secondary bootstrap, status = 00000910 > > > halted CPU 0 > > > halt code = 5 > > HALT instruction executed > > PC = 20004048 > > warning -- HWRPB is invalid > > > Camiel Vanderhoeven > > >http://www.camicom.com/es40 > >http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/es40 > > Seems to me that somehow the disk geometry being used may not be correct. > > What exactly do you mean when you say "CD image"? ...and how was it created? > > Are you sure the geometry of the emulated disk matches the original CD? > > Please provide more info as this is likely where the hiccup will be found. I created the image as follows: I took the original OpenVMS 8.3 installation CD-ROM, and used Nero to extract an ISO image from it. This should result in a flat file, that has all the data on the CD in it. SRM accesses the disk in LBA (logical block addressing) mode, so geometry (cylinders, heads, sectors) should not be an issue. In fact, this seems to be demonstrated already by the fact that SRM manages to load the primary bootstrap image (APB.EXE). It could be that APB.EXE does not use LBA addressing to find SYSBOOT.EXE though... That's something worth checking out. I'll add some more debugging to the IDE emulator, and see if that is the case. Thanks, Camiel. > > -- > David J Dachtera > dba DJE Systemshttp://www.djesys.com/ > > Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Pagehttp://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ > > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ > > Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ > > Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 06:58:42 -0800 From: "Camiel" Subject: Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Message-ID: <1172242721.941227.284310@8g2000cwh.googlegroups.com> On Feb 23, 11:50 am, "Camiel" wrote: > On Feb 23, 1:24 am, David J Dachtera > wrote: > > > > >Camielwrote: > > > > Oops... I saw that my last reply was a response to a different post > > > than the one I replied to. > > > > I'm booting OpenVMS 8.3 (7.3 gives a similar message) on an ES40, so > > > the hardware I'm trying to emulate should be compatible with the OS. > > > > The primary bootstrap, APB.EXE, is found correctly. My emulator runs > > > the actual SRM console and PAL code, so I'm not emulating that. The > > > complete boot sequence looks like this: > > > > AlphaServer ES40 Console V7.2-1, built on Jun 9 2006 at 15:36:48 > > > > CPU 0 booting > > > > (boot dqa0.0.0.15.0 -flags 0,0) > > > block 0 of dqa0.0.0.15.0 is a valid boot block > > > reading 1226 blocks from dqa0.0.0.15.0 > > > bootstrap code read in > > > base = 200000, image_start = 0, image_bytes = 99400(627712) > > > initializing HWRPB at 2000 > > > initializing page table at 7f56000 > > > initializing machine state > > > setting affinity to the primary CPU > > > jumping to bootstrap code > > > %APB-I-FILENOTLOC, Unable to locate SYSBOOT.EXE > > > %APB-I-LOADFAIL, Failed to load secondary bootstrap, status = 00000910 > > > > halted CPU 0 > > > > halt code = 5 > > > HALT instruction executed > > > PC = 20004048 > > > warning -- HWRPB is invalid > > > >CamielVanderhoeven > > > >http://www.camicom.com/es40 > > >http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/es40 > > > Seems to me that somehow the disk geometry being used may not be correct. > > > What exactly do you mean when you say "CD image"? ...and how was it created? > > > Are you sure the geometry of the emulated disk matches the original CD? > > > Please provide more info as this is likely where the hiccup will be found. > > I created the image as follows: I took the original OpenVMS 8.3 > installation CD-ROM, and used Nero to extract an ISO image from it. > This should result in a flat file, that has all the data on the CD in > it. SRM accesses the disk in LBA (logical block addressing) mode, so > geometry (cylinders, heads, sectors) should not be an issue. In fact, > this seems to be demonstrated already by the fact that SRM manages to > load the primary bootstrap image (APB.EXE). > > It could be that APB.EXE does not use LBA addressing to find > SYSBOOT.EXE though... That's something worth checking out. I'll add > some more debugging to the IDE emulator, and see if that is the case. > I added some more debugging, and all disc-accesses while APB is running are done in LBA mode, one sector at a time, so that's not it. The information APB.EXE reads from the disk looks a lot like a VMS directory to me. (I see stuff like SYS0.DIR) Camiel. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:13:42 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Message-ID: Bob Koehler wrote: > In article <1172143525.297588.189480@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "Camiel" writes: >> >> jumping to bootstrap code >> %APB-I-FILENOTLOC, Unable to locate SYSBOOT.EXE You need to boot that node as a satelline. And then use the WRITEBOOT utility to cause the locationn of the SYSBOOT.EXE file to be written to some specific sectors at the top of the disk drive so that the hardware can find and load the code. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 13:40:48 -0500 From: Stephen Hoffman Subject: Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Message-ID: JF Mezei wrote: > Bob Koehler wrote: >> In article <1172143525.297588.189480@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, >> "Camiel" writes: >>> >>> jumping to bootstrap code >>> %APB-I-FILENOTLOC, Unable to locate SYSBOOT.EXE > > You need to boot that node as a satelline. And then use the WRITEBOOT > utility to cause the locationn of the SYSBOOT.EXE file to be written to > some specific sectors at the top of the disk drive so that the hardware > can find and load the code. Um, WRITEBOOT and SET BOOTBLOCK operate on references from LBN0 to (in the case of OpenVMS Alpha) APB.EXE, and not on SYSBOOT.EXE. APB.EXE is the primary bootstrap file for OpenVMS Alpha, and -- once loaded by the SRM console -- it then uses an in-built file system and various data structures and driver hooks to locate and load the secondary bootstrap image, SYSBOOT.EXE. This particular bootstrap sequence is already well past the point of the bootblock references and of loading APB.EXE, too, as APB.EXE is already looking around for the secondary bootfile. This is the primitive file system and the console and related bootstrap driver code that are in flight -- and failing -- here. On no evidence, my bet here is on Nero. Either the tool itself, or the particular command sequence involved. Replicate the disk on OpenVMS itself using COPY on a foreign-mounted CD, or by using CDDVD/COPY on V8.3 and later (SET COMMAND SYS$ETC:CDDVD$TOOLS first) or use a tool such as the Unix DD tool to replicate the disk. The "for grins" test here: burn a CD disk from this image, and see if a real OpenVMS box "likes" it, or if ANALYZE kicks out any errors, or if SYSBOOT is missing or otherwise unreachable. Various of the PC tools will happily not do what exactly you expect in this area, based on long experience chasing these cases. In one case, the PC tool was happily chunking off the first 128 blocks or so during the recording, as that was clearly not valid on any CD or so the authors of the tool had assumed. It actually ignored everything in front of where the ISO-9660 structures are located. The tough part here is that some versions and some version levels of these PC recording tools can work just fine, and others can be really weird. And there's no consistent terminology across the tools. If you use a Microsoft Windows box, one of the few tools I've found reasonably functional in this regard is the CDBurnerXP package. It's also free. And it's also pretty easy to use. The other issue here can be due to the particular emulation of the AlphaServer ES40 box, as that's a non-trivial undertaking. Hardware bugs can be rather cryptic, and emulators present hardware bugs. And without the APB bootstrap sequence and processing description from the IDSM and without the APB and related driver interface source listings, this case of emulation failure is even more interesting and difficult to troubleshoot and to resolve. -- www.HoffmanLabs.com Services for OpenVMS ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 05:35:23 -0800 From: "jhjr4381" Subject: Oracle DBO/VERIFY error Message-ID: <1172237723.047326.13700@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com> Oracle newbie here, please assume I know nothing! We have an Alpha server (Alpha3)running VMS v7.3 and Oracle DBMS,CDD,Rdb 7.0. I have another Alpha server (Alpha1) I just upgraded to VMS E8.2 with Oracle DBMS,CDD/Rep, Rdb 7.2. I FTP'd some .DBB files from Alpha3 (VMS7.3) server so I could DBO/Restore them to Alpha1 ( VMS 8.2) server and got when running the following .com file: DBO/RESTORE/NOCDD_INTEGRATE - /DIRECTORY=MM$DISK:[MANMAN.MANDB000] - /ROOT=MM$DISK:[MANMAN.MANDB000] - /FILE=MM$DISK:[MANMAN.MANDB000] - MM$DISK:[MANMAN.MANDB000]MANDBV121.DBB $ set default MM$DISK:[MANMAN.MANDB000] $ @MM$COM:DBOCREATE_CHECK GRANT MM$DISK:[MANMAN.MANDB000]MANDB $ set default SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR] got the following errors: @MANDBV121.COM %DBO-W-BADDBBCSM, bad checksum calculated for backup record number 4096 %DBO-W-BADDBBCSM, bad checksum calculated for backup record number 1073814784 %DBO-W-BADDBBCSM, bad checksum calculated for backup record number 842748738 . .There were 8/10 bad checksum errors here at different backup record numbers . %DBO-W-BADDBBCSM, bad checksum calculated for backup record number 16384 %DBO-F-FTLDBBERR, backup file contains records with non-recoverable errors So I went back to the Alpha3 server and ran DBO/VERIFY to see if I had a problem with my original database and got the following error: ALPHA3: dbo/verify/cdd mandb %DBO-F-BADSCHVER, root schema version number disagrees with CDD schema path "MM$DISKCDD:[MANMAN.CDD.SCHEMA]MANMAN.MANDB.MANDB" schema version in root file is "14-SEP-1983 19:20:32.94 (48)" schema version in CDD is "14-SEP-1983 19:20:32.94 (47)" However, if I run the DBO/VERIFY with the NOCDD option, I get no errors: $ DBO/VERIFY/LOG/NOCDD/SUMMARY MM$DISK:[MANMAN.MANDB000]MANDB %DBO-I-DBBOUND, bound to database "ALPHA3$DKA200: [MANMAN.MANDB000]MANDB.ROO;1" %DBO-I-NOCDDVFY, CDD metadata not being verified %DBO-I-OPENAREA, opened storage area FLGAREA for protected retrieval %DBO-I-PAGERANGE, verification page range 1 to 84 of area FLGAREA %DBO-I-BEGINSEGV, beginning segment verification of FLGAREA area . . . DBO-S-NOSEGERRS, no segment format errors encountered %DBO-S-NOSETERRS, no set chain errors encountered %DBO-I-CLOSAREAS, releasing protected retrieval lock on all storage areas %DBO-I-SUMPAGERR, 0 page errors encountered %DBO-I-SUMSEGERR, 0 segment errors encountered %DBO-I-SUMSETERR, 0 set errors encountered My question is, does the first dbo/verify error have anything to do with the dbo/restore error. Regardless, what do I do the remedy either/ or. Should I redo my backup and try again? Did FTP do something to the .dbb files? Thanks for any help proffered! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:32:36 +0100 From: "Dr. Dweeb" Subject: Re: OT: Quebec Health Care Virus Message-ID: <45dea6a3$0$177$157c6196@dreader1.cybercity.dk> Doug Phillips wrote: > On Feb 22, 6:45 pm, "Richard B. gilbert" > wrote: >> Doug Phillips wrote: >>> On Feb 21, 6:47 pm, b...@instantwhip.com wrote: >> >>>> I continue to be amazed at how people here continue to state >>>> the flawed fact that another solution is cheaper and better than >>>> vms ... >> >>>> WRONG! >> >>>> when you take that higher initial investment and divide it over >>>> decades >>>> of virus free 99.9999 uptime enviroment your TCO on vms wins >>>> overwhelmingly ... >> >>>> also, they should be using vms to save money because they are >>>> broke running a socialized healthcare system the same one Hillary >>>> Clinton and the democrats are and have been pushing for years ... >> >>>> look at Canadas broken system and think about that the next >>>> election ... >> >>> Not being a Canadian, I don't know how good that health care system >>> is. I do consider the U.S.'s system to be badly broken. >> >>> A quick search will show you that: >> >>> - the per-capita spending for health care in the U.S. is nearly >>> double that of Canada (and Australia, and France) and more than >>> double that in the UK. >> >>> - their life expectancy is higher than in the U.S. >> To chime in, its also higher than Denmark and i believe Sweden, both countries with national health care systems. I would also note, that the figures quoted here are Government Expenditures on health care. That is to say for the USA, that Medicare & Medicaid, plus various other sundry items, use more $ per capita in the USA than National systems in other countries, sometimes by a factor or two. I have no clue why this is the case (actually I do but it is not so relevant in this post). I just thought folks should understand what they were talking about. Dweeb. >> It's just barely possible that they eat a healthier diet and get more >> exercise than we do!! >> >> > > > Maybe. But, the U.S. health care system is still very, very broken. > > Maybe, in those countries, a higher portion of the money goes towards > actual health care, and not towards middle-man expenses and profits > and dividends and executive bonuses. (who do you guess makes more > money; your family doctor or your insurance company execs, if you have > insurance?) > > Maybe those doctors and staff don't waste a major part of their days > fighting insurance companies for approval to treat a patient, and > having to justify that treatment or figure out how to treat you within > the limits imposed by your insurance company. (who do you guess > understands your medical condition best; your doctor or your insurance > company?) > > Maybe people with access to heath care are more likely to see a doctor > before a problem becomes severe. > > Maybe more people receive prenatal care, rather than only those with > enough money to pay for insurance and can cover their deductable even > if they have insurance. > > Maybe fewer people in those countries are forced to use emergency > rooms as their only access to health care because they can't afford > insurance, and maybe the hospitals there aren't forced to raise others > costs to pay for services provided to people who can't pay. > > Maybe there are many, many more reasons. Yep. I've been pretty close > to the jagged edges of this broken system (if you haven't already > guessed.) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:48:24 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: OT: Quebec Health Care Virus Message-ID: <6184e$45df1adf$cef8887a$21568@TEKSAVVY.COM> Doug Phillips wrote: > Not being a Canadian, I don't know how good that health care system > is. I do consider the U.S.'s system to be badly broken. Actually, this isn't so much about the end results of the health care system here. It is all about system management of a large network of workstations. (I assume everyone agrees that 90,000 systems is a large network ?). And it is about having realistic staffing levels to allow your systems to have sufficient maintenance to prevent such disasters. Many countries around the world have had their government in significant "diets" over the last 2 decades. Such government essentially operate permanently like GM/Ford/Chrysler are doing right now. There are no cash-cow seasons to bring back the bloat which is what happens in private industry. It is clear that in this particular case, the government trimmed the IT workforce below a sustainable level because 1 person is not enough to maintain 200 windows machines. The Windows proponets aren't going to admit to it. And trade rags aren't exactly filled with trily trustable content on the right staffing levels for various platforms. If Gartner pushes Linux or Windows, it isn't about to start warning customers "BY The way, if you do choose the solution we are recommending, you will need to double your IT workforce". And those vendors who do provide lower IT workforce costs (such as Apple vs Windows or VMS vs Unix/Windows) do not have the ear of trade rags. Perhaps VMS might have the ear of trade rags if VMS started to pay for ADVERTISING in those trade rags. But if HP pays for ads for its PCs, then the trade rag will be kind to the PCs. So, in the end, it is very important for an OS such as VMS to make sure the world knows that the REALISTIC workforce is much lower for VMS than for other systems, and that any organisation (whether private or govt) should really consider VMS as an opportunity to cut costs AND provide more stable devlivery of services to their core business. In this specific case, a vendor could go to the quebec government and ofer a solution that would allow the goverment to provide better services with the same IT headcount and prevent such disasters. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 10:00:27 -0800 From: "Doug Phillips" Subject: Re: OT: Quebec Health Care Virus Message-ID: <1172253627.334633.162080@8g2000cwh.googlegroups.com> On Feb 23, 10:48 am, JF Mezei wrote: > Doug Phillips wrote: > > Not being a Canadian, I don't know how good that health care system > > is. I do consider the U.S.'s system to be badly broken. > > Actually, this isn't so much about the end results of the health care > system here. It is all about system management of a large network of > workstations. (I assume everyone agrees that 90,000 systems is a large > network ?). And it is about having realistic staffing levels to allow your > systems to have sufficient maintenance to prevent such disasters. > > Many countries around the world have had their government in significant > "diets" over the last 2 decades. Such government essentially operate > permanently like GM/Ford/Chrysler are doing right now. There are no > cash-cow seasons to bring back the bloat which is what happens in private > industry. > > It is clear that in this particular case, the government trimmed the IT > workforce below a sustainable level because 1 person is not enough to > maintain 200 windows machines. The Windows proponets aren't going to admit > to it. And trade rags aren't exactly filled with trily trustable content on > the right staffing levels for various platforms. > > If Gartner pushes Linux or Windows, it isn't about to start warning > customers "BY The way, if you do choose the solution we are recommending, > you will need to double your IT workforce". > > And those vendors who do provide lower IT workforce costs (such as Apple vs > Windows or VMS vs Unix/Windows) do not have the ear of trade rags. Perhaps > VMS might have the ear of trade rags if VMS started to pay for ADVERTISING > in those trade rags. > > But if HP pays for ads for its PCs, then the trade rag will be kind to the PCs. > > So, in the end, it is very important for an OS such as VMS to make sure the > world knows that the REALISTIC workforce is much lower for VMS than for > other systems, and that any organisation (whether private or govt) should > really consider VMS as an opportunity to cut costs AND provide more stable > devlivery of services to their core business. > > In this specific case, a vendor could go to the quebec government and ofer > a solution that would allow the goverment to provide better services with > the same IT headcount and prevent such disasters. In the US, there is a functioning health care system that stands apart from the commercial insurance driven system; the Veterans Administration's VHA. The software, VistA, is MUMPS driven and OpenVMS based. It is available to any health care provider. While there have been politically driven problems in the VHA, the technical side of the system is sound and has proven to improve health care efficiency and lower provider costs. More than that about VistA, I don't know, but I think some of the VHA folks lurk here. I do know that there are answers to the broken U.S. health care system, and the obstacles are political, not technical. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 11:18:08 +0100 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOeGER) Subject: RENAME/QUEUE again Message-ID: <45decd70$1@news.langstoeger.at> As the need popped up again: Am I the only one who still miss a RENAME/QUEUE command ? Is it really such a big problem to create such a functionality ? (or is $SNDJBC a don't touch area ;-) A Create[/Merge]/Delete Queue is surely not that much fun if you need to rename more than a couple of queues (all with ACLs and such)... Any hope ? -- Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER Network and OpenVMS system specialist E-mail peter@langstoeger.at A-1030 VIENNA AUSTRIA I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 06:10:26 -0800 From: "Bobby" Subject: Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems Message-ID: <1172239826.417913.222380@k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Define the parameter in your MODPARAMS.DAT configuration file and run AUTOGEN through REBOOT. modparams.dat ... AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV=1 ... Bobby ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 18:03:15 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com Subject: Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems Message-ID: Bobby wrote: > Define the parameter in your MODPARAMS.DAT configuration file and run > AUTOGEN through REBOOT. > modparams.dat > ... > AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV=1 > ... Already done. It doesn't allow the SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE logical to survive a reboot. The only way I can make this work is defining SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE in SYLOGICALS.COM. Zane ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:25:55 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Terry Shannon article nominated for Wikipedia deletion Message-ID: Ian Miller wrote: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Terry_Shannon > > I think there are people here who would disagree. Go to the above page > and let them know. > Pardon my ineptness with this newfangled thing called the internet, but how does one go about to add one's comments in the above link ? I tried "edit" and it seems to give me the whole page to edit (as opposed to adding my comments). I tried Talk and it tells me there is no talk page currently existing for this topic. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 22:47:59 +0800 From: Paul Repacholi Subject: Re: Terry Shannon article nominated for Wikipedia deletion Message-ID: <87zm756icg.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> "Ian Miller" writes: > what they seem to want is indepentantly verifiable information > demonstrating that Terry was notable. Notable seemingly defined as `in Google'. Don't they understand that the world existed before Google, the web, or the net... Sorry, stupid question. ------------ And now a word from our sponsor ------------------ Want to have instant messaging, and chat rooms, and discussion groups for your local users or business, you need dbabble! -- See http://netwinsite.com/sponsor/sponsor_dbabble.htm ---- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:20:08 +0000 (UTC) From: Mikko Putkonen Subject: Re: Terry Shannon article nominated for Wikipedia deletion Message-ID: JF Mezei wrote: > Ian Miller wrote: >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Terry_Shannon > Pardon my ineptness with this newfangled thing called the internet, but how > does one go about to add one's comments in the above link ? I tried "edit" > and it seems to give me the whole page to edit (as opposed to adding my > comments). I tried Talk and it tells me there is no talk page currently > existing for this topic. The page is now archived and shouldn't be edited: They put the discussion about deleting the Shannon article on hold for the moment at least. If you want to add comments about the man, try http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Terry_Shannon instead. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Contents/Editing_Wikipedia for some pointers about how to start editing, and you can also learn quite a bit about editing by simply looking at the "sources" of the article -- what others have already written. ("Edit this page", or "edit" to edit sub-sections of article.) Use "show preview" and/or "show changes" before you "save page". Etc... -Mikko ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 22:56:06 +0800 From: Paul Repacholi Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <87r6sg7wjd.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > In article <87irdv648t.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>, > Paul Repacholi writes: >> >> I seem to remember having a drive with a `motor fault' that was >> in fact something a lot less drastic to fix. > OK, I ran a bunch of diagnostics and partially dismanteled it. > Looks like the tach on the Take-up motor is not working. :-( The take up tach is on the tension arm on the top. It is a prime dust bunny haven! > Anybody got spare parts for a TSZ07 sitting around gathering dust? > Looks to be what the manual says for a "5F Motor Fault" error. > Change the Take-Up motor and/or the logic board. Changing the takeup motor is a pain from memory.It is totally enclosed in the vacumb box, and you then have to re-set the hub height. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 17:44:01 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <548nf0F1vidc8U1@mid.individual.net> In article <87r6sg7wjd.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi writes: > bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > >> In article <87irdv648t.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>, >> Paul Repacholi writes: >>> >>> I seem to remember having a drive with a `motor fault' that was >>> in fact something a lot less drastic to fix. > >> OK, I ran a bunch of diagnostics and partially dismanteled it. >> Looks like the tach on the Take-up motor is not working. :-( > > The take up tach is on the tension arm on the top. It is a prime > dust bunny haven! Are you sure? Then what is the wheel on the bottom that spins inbetween that sensor? (See picture on website!) I just looked again and there are no wires or anything coming from the tension arm so I don't see how it could containt he tach sensor. > >> Anybody got spare parts for a TSZ07 sitting around gathering dust? >> Looks to be what the manual says for a "5F Motor Fault" error. >> Change the Take-Up motor and/or the logic board. > > Changing the takeup motor is a pain from memory.It is totally enclosed > in the vacumb box, Two screws opened that up. Four screws on top release the motor. Took all of 3 minutes to get it out. > and you then have to re-set the hub height. Also trivial. I've done it twice since I have been working on this one unit. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 23 Feb 2007 10:11:15 -0800 From: peter.hunt@opengear.com Subject: Re: VT320 or 420 keypad codes Message-ID: <1172254274.970874.185990@8g2000cwh.googlegroups.com> minicom will do the trick but maybe overkill for a simple null-modem connection (I also find it a little quirky when saving settings). I usually use 'tip' or 'cu' from the UUCP package for Linux for the simplicity, you could also try gtkterm if you are used to a HyperTerminal type interface. On Feb 21, 1:34 am, "urbancamo" wrote: > I use minicom to connect to my Alpha serial port. > > It works very well. > > Mark. > > John Santos wrote: > > Thomas Dickey wrote: > > > Steve Bainbridge wrote: > > > >>Is it possible to use xterm to access the console port of a VMS system > > >>i.e. via a PCs serial port ? > > > > There's a program called "seyon" which does modem connections as a shell > > > around xterm. > > > > (I haven't used serial connections in quite a while -ymmv). > > > iirc, Debian has a package for it. > > > Another possibility is to run C-Kermit in an xterm window on the Linux > > box, and connect to the VMS system's console using a null modem between > > a serial port on the Linux box and the VMSserial consoleport. > > > You could also use latd's llogin program (Unix LAT emulator) to a > > DECServer terminalserverwith a null modem connected to the VMSserial> console(or a bunch of VMS serial consoles) running in an xterm window. > > Telnet to an IP-capable terminalserverwould also work. (Some people > > have said they've experienced serious problems with latd, but I've not > > had any problems in light usage on a Mac OS X 10.4 Powerbook.) > > > -- > > John Santos > > Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. > > 781-861-0670 ext 539 ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.108 ************************