INFO-VAX Mon, 20 Aug 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 456 Contents: Re: Alpha/Integrity Dead Pool RE: Alpha/Integrity Dead Pool Re: Alpha/Integrity Dead Pool Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? blind? Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? blind? AppleTalk on Alpha VMS 8.3 Re: AppleTalk on Alpha VMS 8.3 EMACS [was: Free to good home. Microvaxes, Vaxstations, Alphas] Re: EMACS [was: Free to good home. Microvaxes, Vaxstations, Alphas] Re: File Version limit Reset Re: Free to good home. Microvaxes, Vaxstations, Alphas Re: Fun with bugs Re: Gzip 1.3.12? RE: Intel marginalizing Itanium even faster than expected? RE: Intel marginalizing Itanium even faster than expected? RE: Intel marginalizing Itanium even faster than expected? Jobs from all job sites - at one place, in one Gladoo search (www.Gladoo.com) Re: Looking for SEDT source code Re: Looking for SEDT source code Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Contract Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont RE: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Teach Yourself SAP in 24 Hours Guide ! Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion RE: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Re: Write locked file Re: X Window Servers Re: You know you've been around VMS too long when... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Aug 2007 07:43:11 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Alpha/Integrity Dead Pool Message-ID: In article , Michael Kraemer writes: > FredK schrieb: > >> Why didn't IBM >> adopt Alpha rather than invest in Power? > > Maybe because Power was on the market way before alpha ? > ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 07:46:41 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: RE: Alpha/Integrity Dead Pool Message-ID: In article <001801c7e1b9$d0607450$71215cf0$@com>, "Paul Raulerson" writes: > > Now I wonder what it would take to port VMS to the mainframe? > 1) roll out a VAX 9000 2) load VMS I think some of the Alphas and perhaps some of the Itaniums can also be considered mainframes, and much better investments than a 9000. But if you want to port VMS to a 370 architecture mainframe or some other such beast all it takes is a lot of customers with deep pockets to commit to making it profitable. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 07:51:00 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Alpha/Integrity Dead Pool Message-ID: In article <2N%xi.54568$GO6.24819@newsfe21.lga>, Ron Johnson writes: > > (All VAX microcode was/could be loaded from floppy, so you could > replace DEC microcode with your own, thus making certain opcodes do > something completely different that what DEC had designed.) All the way back to 11/780 some of the microcode was on ROM, not floppy. You could, however, buy an optional user writeable control store and microcode compiler for the 11/780 (shipped with the 11/750), and write your own insructions. I know a site that used the VAX microcode compiler to write emulations of a special purpose processor they were building for a customer. They has "hardware" to test software on before they build any hardware. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 07 13:33:21 EDT From: cook@wvnvms.wvnet.edu (George Cook) Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case Message-ID: In article <07081922163361_20200296@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes: > From: > >> We are starting to migrate from VAX/VMS 5.5-2 (Ingres 6.4/06) to OpenVMS >> Alpha 8.3 (Ingres 9.0.4/105). > > That's a jump. > >> The VAX disks have the ODS-2 (Files11?) >> file system (case insensitive, uppercase) on which Ingres 6.4 is >> installed and on which various report, data and log files are written. >> Applications are written in ABF and ESQL or EQUEL access data on these >> disks and might refer to the same file in uppercase, lowercase or a >> combination in different places in the code. > > Case-blind is case-blind. ODS5 allows more and more exotic > characters in file names, but old code should, in general, just work. > MMS (especially the new "ODS5-compatible" MMS) can get confused in some > cases which would have worked before, but most stuff just works. The current release (V3.8) of MMS when installed with "Extended File Specification support" is broken even on ODS2 disks. Engineering's first attempt to fix it was only a minor improvement. George Cook WVNET ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:31:51 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: <1187613111.568727.151270@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> On Aug 19, 11:16 pm, s...@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote: > From: > [...] > > Are there hidden gotchas, etc.? Anybody have any (bad) experiences they > > can relate while doing a similar migration? > > The biggest problems I've seen are less case-related, more > exotic-character-related. Methods like looking for "]" or "." to > decompose a file spec are less reliable when the file spech looks like, > say, "dka100:[d^.i^.r^[]a^]^.b.c". If you continue to use > ODS2-compatible names, that reduces the possibilities for problems. > Sadly, there's no real substitute for testing. That's why you should always use F$PARSE (or its system services equivalent) whenever possible. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org > 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 > Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 AEF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:38:59 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: <1187613539.150273.165450@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com> On Aug 20, 12:08 am, "John E. Malmberg" wrote: > tkupp.x...@sasktel.xspamx.net wrote: [...] > You will have to test your applications if to see if they are doing > directory reads and expecting that files may exist with a different case > than they were created on. > > A potential gotcha may be programs that are not aware of ODS-5, and will > do internal name mangling like replacing extra dots with things like > "_", so the filenames will not match what other applications are > expecting. Programs that did their own filename/directory parsing or > VMS to UNIX conversions tend not handle ODS-5 volumes correctly. Again, this is the reason that programs should use $PARSE (or SYS $PARSE, or whatever the hell it's called!) if at all possible. [...] > > -John > wb8...@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only AEF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 09:32:56 -0500 (CDT) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: <07082009325595_20200296@antinode.org> From: "Richard B. Gilbert" > AEF wrote: > > That's why you should always use F$PARSE (or its system services > > equivalent) whenever possible. Well, duh. > When would it not be possible to use F$PARSE? It's normally _possible_, but when you inherit code which says things like: [...] #if defined(VAXC) || defined(VMS) # define PATH_SEP ']' # define PATH_SEP2 ':' # define SUFFIX_SEP ';' # define NO_MULTIPLE_DOTS # define Z_SUFFIX "-gz" [...] then you can expect it to be annoying and/or difficult to convert it to use $PARSE instead of its own name-parsing code. > If you don't use F$PARSE, > there is an excellent possibility that someone can construct a legal > file spec that you cannot parse correctly. Someone _can_, but it may be pretty unlikely. > Legal file specs, even if > you limit them to ODS-2 file specs, can get pretty weird. You have to > remember that VMS inherited a lot of cruft from DEC operating systems > that only the old timers remember! Assuming that most folks won't actually be using ";" or ":" or "]" in file names (or "<>" to delimit a directory, or ...), then much of such sub-ideal code can be expected to work (for most people, most of the time). ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 07:57:43 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: <1187621863.327008.106790@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com> On Aug 20, 10:22 am, "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote: > AEF wrote: > > On Aug 19, 11:16 pm, s...@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote: > > >>From: > > > [...] > > >>>Are there hidden gotchas, etc.? Anybody have any (bad) experiences they > >>>can relate while doing a similar migration? > > >> The biggest problems I've seen are less case-related, more > >>exotic-character-related. Methods like looking for "]" or "." to > >>decompose a file spec are less reliable when the file spech looks like, > >>say, "dka100:[d^.i^.r^[]a^]^.b.c". If you continue to use > >>ODS2-compatible names, that reduces the possibilities for problems. > >>Sadly, there's no real substitute for testing. > > > That's why you should always use F$PARSE (or its system services > > equivalent) whenever possible. > > When would it not be possible to use F$PARSE? If you don't use F$PARSE, > there is an excellent possibility that someone can construct a legal > file spec that you cannot parse correctly. Legal file specs, even if > you limit them to ODS-2 file specs, can get pretty weird. You have to > remember that VMS inherited a lot of cruft from DEC operating systems > that only the old timers remember! You're absolutely right, but I actually had such a reason once. It was my TO.COM (set default program). I wanted to be able to type in the target directory-spec without using the brackets. I did use F$PARSE as much as I could, but had to do just a little parsing on my own because of this requirement. (TO.COM *does* require that logical names that point to directories include the brackets and follow all the other RMS rules, but I really wanted to be able to type DISK:DIR instead of DISK: [DIR] and DIR instead of [DIR] on the command line. (This was actually a major "selling point" for some users.) One day I'll try it on an ODS-5 disk (if I can find a VMS box on the net that has one! I'm looking to check Deathrow next, but hints as to where to look are welcome). But I *do* warn in my instructions that it was written for ODS-2. I'm curious what problems will arise and what modifications to the program would be useful. I was also just speaking generally in that you never know what someone might need. But I think 99.9% of the time F$PARSE should do what you need. AEF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 08:04:51 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: <1187622291.965347.91950@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com> On Aug 20, 10:32 am, s...@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote: > From: "Richard B. Gilbert" > > > AEF wrote: > > > That's why you should always use F$PARSE (or its system services > > > equivalent) whenever possible. > > Well, duh. Just emphasizing the point and trying to make it perfectly clear and pound the point home in a (perhaps futile) effort to minimize the changes of anyone skipping F$PARSE without good reason. Duh! > > > When would it not be possible to use F$PARSE? > > It's normally _possible_, but when you inherit code which says things > like: > > [...] > #if defined(VAXC) || defined(VMS) > # define PATH_SEP ']' > # define PATH_SEP2 ':' > # define SUFFIX_SEP ';' > # define NO_MULTIPLE_DOTS > # define Z_SUFFIX "-gz" > [...] > > then you can expect it to be annoying and/or difficult to convert it to > use $PARSE instead of its own name-parsing code. > > > If you don't use F$PARSE, > > there is an excellent possibility that someone can construct a legal > > file spec that you cannot parse correctly. > > Someone _can_, but it may be pretty unlikely. > > > Legal file specs, even if > > you limit them to ODS-2 file specs, can get pretty weird. You have to > > remember that VMS inherited a lot of cruft from DEC operating systems > > that only the old timers remember! > > Assuming that most folks won't actually be using ";" or ":" or "]" in > file names (or "<>" to delimit a directory, or ...), then much of such > sub-ideal code can be expected to work (for most people, most of the > time). Yep. My program doesn't like [0,0], but I thought users could get by without it, and the code uses \ as a shortcut for the MFD anyway. I suppose I could special case it for my next release, if I do one. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org > 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 > Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 Chill out, dude. Go peruse sci.physics if you want to see what a *REALLY* bad newsgroup is like. AEF ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 11:57:17 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: In article <1187613539.150273.165450@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: > > Again, this is the reason that programs should use $PARSE (or SYS > $PARSE, or whatever the hell it's called!) if at all possible. > I generally prefer to use $FILESCAN. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 11:59:26 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: In article <1187621863.327008.106790@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: > > You're absolutely right, but I actually had such a reason once. It was > my TO.COM (set default program). Like many people I have and sd.com that adds the brackets when appropriate. It works fine with ODS-5, but I replaced one of my shortcut symbols (^) with \ just in case I ever need to start a directory name with ^. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 12:00:41 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: In article <07082009325595_20200296@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes: > > Assuming that most folks won't actually be using ";" or ":" or "]" in > file names (or "<>" to delimit a directory, or ...), then much of such > sub-ideal code can be expected to work (for most people, most of the > time). Works for most of the people most of the time? You sound like Bill Gates. I have gainfull employment fixing that kind of code. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 10:25:09 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? Message-ID: <1187630709.660245.306140@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Aug 20, 1:00 pm, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote: > In article <07082009325595_20200...@antinode.org>, s...@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes: > > > > > Assuming that most folks won't actually be using ";" or ":" or "]" in > > file names (or "<>" to delimit a directory, or ...), then much of such > > sub-ideal code can be expected to work (for most people, most of the > > time). > > Works for most of the people most of the time? You sound like Bill > Gates. > > I have gainfull employment fixing that kind of code. If only his software were even _that_ good! You give him too much credit. AEF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 10:22:34 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? blind? Message-ID: <46C9A3AA.2090202@comcast.net> AEF wrote: > On Aug 19, 11:16 pm, s...@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote: > >>From: >> > [...] > > >>>Are there hidden gotchas, etc.? Anybody have any (bad) experiences they >>>can relate while doing a similar migration? >> >> The biggest problems I've seen are less case-related, more >>exotic-character-related. Methods like looking for "]" or "." to >>decompose a file spec are less reliable when the file spech looks like, >>say, "dka100:[d^.i^.r^[]a^]^.b.c". If you continue to use >>ODS2-compatible names, that reduces the possibilities for problems. >>Sadly, there's no real substitute for testing. > > > That's why you should always use F$PARSE (or its system services > equivalent) whenever possible. When would it not be possible to use F$PARSE? If you don't use F$PARSE, there is an excellent possibility that someone can construct a legal file spec that you cannot parse correctly. Legal file specs, even if you limit them to ODS-2 file specs, can get pretty weird. You have to remember that VMS inherited a lot of cruft from DEC operating systems that only the old timers remember! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 11:32:25 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: Any filename problems going from VAX/ODS-2 to Alpha/ODS-5/case blind? blind? Message-ID: <46C9B409.8070505@comcast.net> Steven M. Schweda wrote: > From: "Richard B. Gilbert" > >>AEF wrote: >> >>>That's why you should always use F$PARSE (or its system services >>>equivalent) whenever possible. >> > > Well, duh. > > >>When would it not be possible to use F$PARSE? > > > It's normally _possible_, but when you inherit code which says things > like: > > [...] > #if defined(VAXC) || defined(VMS) > # define PATH_SEP ']' > # define PATH_SEP2 ':' > # define SUFFIX_SEP ';' > # define NO_MULTIPLE_DOTS > # define Z_SUFFIX "-gz" > [...] > > then you can expect it to be annoying and/or difficult to convert it to > use $PARSE instead of its own name-parsing code. > > >> If you don't use F$PARSE, >>there is an excellent possibility that someone can construct a legal >>file spec that you cannot parse correctly. > > > Someone _can_, but it may be pretty unlikely. > > >> Legal file specs, even if >>you limit them to ODS-2 file specs, can get pretty weird. You have to >>remember that VMS inherited a lot of cruft from DEC operating systems >>that only the old timers remember! > > > Assuming that most folks won't actually be using ";" or ":" or "]" in > file names (or "<>" to delimit a directory, or ...), then much of such > sub-ideal code can be expected to work (for most people, most of the > time). Well, if having your code work for most people, most of the time, is sufficient. . . . It's not that difficult to get it right and have it work for everyone, all of the time. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 10:14:25 -0700 From: Ed Wilts Subject: AppleTalk on Alpha VMS 8.3 Message-ID: <1187630065.505196.200520@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com> Has anybody tested AppleTalk on 8.3 to see if it still works? Yes, I know it's not supported. Yes, I know I need to get rid of it. Neither of those 2 are relevant to the question :-) Thanks, .../Ed Ed Wilts, RHCE, BCFP, BCSD mailto:ewilts@ewilts.org ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 13:49:00 -0400 From: Paul Anderson Subject: Re: AppleTalk on Alpha VMS 8.3 Message-ID: In article <1187630065.505196.200520@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com>, Ed Wilts wrote: > Has anybody tested AppleTalk on 8.3 to see if it still works? Assuming you mean the PATHWORKS for OpenVMS (Macintosh) product, no, it does not work on OpenVMS V8.3. Paul -- Paul Anderson OpenVMS Engineering Hewlett-Packard Company ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 06:07:25 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: EMACS [was: Free to good home. Microvaxes, Vaxstations, Alphas] Message-ID: On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:38:18 -0700, Bob Koehler wrote: > In article <170820071419444158%nospam@yrl.co.uk>, Elliott Roper > writes: >> >> I'm using emacs on OS X now, I'm ashamed to relate. >> It is bit verbose, and the syntax colouring is a bit girly, but it has >> the same unforgiving nature that you grow to love in teco. ;-) > > Probably because TECO was the first engine emacs was written on. > A little history FYI http://www.multicians.org/mepap.html -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 16:00:31 +0100 From: Elliott Roper Subject: Re: EMACS [was: Free to good home. Microvaxes, Vaxstations, Alphas] Message-ID: <200820071600318078%nospam@yrl.co.uk> In article , Tom Linden wrote: > On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:38:18 -0700, Bob Koehler > wrote: > > > In article <170820071419444158%nospam@yrl.co.uk>, Elliott Roper > > writes: > >> > >> I'm using emacs on OS X now, I'm ashamed to relate. > >> It is bit verbose, and the syntax colouring is a bit girly, but it has > >> the same unforgiving nature that you grow to love in teco. ;-) > > > > Probably because TECO was the first engine emacs was written on. > > > A little history FYI > http://www.multicians.org/mepap.html Thank you Tom! Fantastic, concentrated goodness! -- To de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$ PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810 E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248 ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 09:42:39 +0200 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOeGER) Subject: Re: File Version limit Reset Message-ID: <46c9620f$1@news.langstoeger.at> In article <1186456803.333604.211070@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Ruger writes: >I know about the rename, I gave an example of 3 files but I am talking >more about 100's which I would like to rename and keep in version >order through a daily/weekly submitted procedure. Change the directory (logical) daily/weekly instead... -- Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER Network and OpenVMS system specialist E-mail peter@langstoeger.at A-1030 VIENNA AUSTRIA I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 07:38:18 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Free to good home. Microvaxes, Vaxstations, Alphas Message-ID: In article <170820071419444158%nospam@yrl.co.uk>, Elliott Roper writes: > > I'm using emacs on OS X now, I'm ashamed to relate. > It is bit verbose, and the syntax colouring is a bit girly, but it has > the same unforgiving nature that you grow to love in teco. ;-) Probably because TECO was the first engine emacs was written on. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 09:26:21 -0400 From: John Reagan Subject: Re: Fun with bugs Message-ID: Doug Phillips wrote: > Ok, I understand. So what if there had been another conditional > statement in the code that set it to FALSE? Do you FIFI or LIFO? Do > the fetch? ...? Shouldn't there be a compile or run-time error or > warning on an illegal operation (or is there one)? (I'm not trying to > be a pest; I don't have Pascal, I don't have access to the internals, > and I have always been fascinated by the hows and whys of compilers. > Must be my BAL beginnings:-) > > If there was some other path that could have set it to FALSE, then I we'll have to fetch it since it could contain two different legal values (and one illegal) This isn't just Pascal by the way. Any GEM-based compiler of recent vintage should show the same optimization. As for a message like: "there exists one or more paths to this fetch that didn't contain a store", yes the flow analyzer does produce pass this information back to the front-end when it can figure it out. Each front-end is free to display or filter as desired. Pascal filters some of the infos coming from inside of GEM for various historical reasons so all of them might not come out. However, for this one: program foo(output); procedure x(inflag : boolean); var b : boolean; begin if inflag then b := true; if b then writeln('true'); end; begin x(false) end. you'll see (hiyall)$ pascal/usage=all x if b then writeln('true'); .....^ %PASCAL-I-UNCERTAIN, B may not have been initialized at line number 9 in file HIYALL$:[REAGAN]X.PAS;4 %PASCAL-S-ENDDIAGS, PASCAL completed with 1 diagnostic If the "IF" was: if inflag then b := true else b := false; then no message. But for something like: if inflag then b := true; if not inflag then b := false; we'll still print the message because we aren't smart enough to track the values. -- John Reagan OpenVMS Pascal/Macro-32/COBOL Project Leader Hewlett-Packard Company ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 13:48:47 +0200 From: Martin Vorlaender Subject: Re: Gzip 1.3.12? Message-ID: <46C97F9F.9090106@pdv-systeme.de> Steven M. Schweda wrote: >From: "Tom Linden" > >> Just tried it on a large file, don't know if this is a bug or not. >> Anything you want me to look at? >> >> HAFNER> gunzip13 MULTICS$TAR.GZ >> >> HAFNER::TOM 08:14:18 GZIP1_3_1 CPU=00:03:58.31 PF=3023 IO=85029 >> MEM=196 >> >> gzip1_3_12: DISK$COMMON:[MULTICS]MULTICS$TAR: non-translatable >> vms error code: 0x1828A >> %rms-e-flk, file currently locked by another user >> %NONAME-E-NOMSG, Message number 00000002 > > Hmmm. Does it to me, too. I know I didn't test it much, but I > thought that I had done more than this, but I didn't notice it before. > Might be a close-delete race condition or something, or perhaps it's > setting date-time info. I suppose that I'll look into it if no one > beats me to it. The error happens with compressing and decompressing alike, when it tries an utimes(file,t) on the (still opened) output file at: module name routine name line *UTIMENS futimens 5910 *GZIP copy_stat 11993 *GZIP treat_file 11183 *GZIP main 10901 *GZIP __main 10641 > It seems to do the actual compress-expand work properly It does. Unfortunately I don't have the time to dig deeper into it for a fix. Keep up the great work! HTH, Martin -- One OS to rule them all | Martin Vorlaender | OpenVMS rules! One OS to find them | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de One OS to bring them all | http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/ And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 07:32:10 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: RE: Intel marginalizing Itanium even faster than expected? Message-ID: <$GoPFruZ5m$2@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article , "Main, Kerry" writes: > > Nobody twiddles OpenVMS kernel code except VMS Engineering and the same goe= > s for > HP-UX, AIX, Solaris etc. Then what do you call it when I add routines to the kernel or patch existing kernel code on my VMS systems? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 13:21:28 +0000 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: RE: Intel marginalizing Itanium even faster than expected? Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: Bob Koehler [mailto:koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org] > Sent: August 20, 2007 8:32 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: RE: Intel marginalizing Itanium even faster than expected? > > In article > t>, "Main, Kerry" writes: > > > > Nobody twiddles OpenVMS kernel code except VMS Engineering and the > same goe=3D > > s for > > HP-UX, AIX, Solaris etc. > > Then what do you call it when I add routines to the kernel or patch > existing kernel code on my VMS systems? An unsupported system? Just to clarify - I was referring to OS kernel code (Scheduler, cluster etc= ), not user or App code that calls or executes in kernel mode. Regards Kerry Main Senior Consultant HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660 Fax: 613-591-4477 kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT) OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 12:03:04 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: RE: Intel marginalizing Itanium even faster than expected? Message-ID: <3i0w4D$Ab9TX@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article , "Main, Kerry" writes: > > An unsupported system? Nope, I had to support it, DEC didn't have to. > > Just to clarify - I was referring to OS kernel code (Scheduler, cluster etc= > ), > not user or App code that calls or executes in kernel mode. And I haven't had to patch kernel code since VMS 4.x, but I did have to write a substitute routine for my driver to call when I found a bug in 6.x. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 06:15:57 -0700 From: Khushi Subject: Jobs from all job sites - at one place, in one Gladoo search (www.Gladoo.com) Message-ID: <1187615757.887792.21280@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com> Dear Friend, Are you looking to put your career on fast track? Gladoo.com helps you find your next dream job and connect you to the right people in your industry. . Find jobs from Naukri, Monster, Times, etc. in one Gladoo search - save time . Search and connect with professionals in your field who can help enhance your career . Ask and get all your career questions answered . Logon to Gladoo.com to find more free career tools You are only 6 people away from that dream job you are aspiring for. Start your career networking and win surprise prizes. Cheers Gladoo.com - Search & Network Your Way Up! TolMol.com - Compare before you buy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 10:28:02 +0200 From: "Dr. Dweeb" Subject: Re: Looking for SEDT source code Message-ID: <46c95098$0$21933$157c6196@dreader1.cybercity.dk> Paul McIlfatrick wrote: > Back on 22nd November 2005 Lee Roth posted the following article in > the comp.unix.solaris newsgroup: > >> Briefly: I have permission from the original author of SEDT (Anker >> Berg-Sonne) to make my modified-for-Solaris binary + source files >> available. >> >> If you've never used the DEC EDT editor I certainly don't suggest you >> begin to do so now, but if you are an old-time DEC user like me that >> has the EDT editor burned deep into your brain's ROM, you may want to >> give this powerful EDT-on-steroids editor a look. >> >> I had to do a couple of minor tweaks to get the sources to compile, >> but I have created a binary that runs on Solaris 7, 8 and 9 (Sparc) >> and a separate binary that (at least) Solaris 7 on Intel platforms. >> I have not yet tested the binary on Solaris 10 (Sparc). >> >> Additional details at http://easy48.com/sedt/ >> >> Check out the above link... if interested, please respond to this >> posting. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Lee Roth > > A few days ago I posted an article to the comp.unix.solaris newsgroup > asking if Lee Roth had ever made the modified-for-Solaris binary + > source files available. I got three replies, each trying to be funny > about painting the numlock key gold. > > In Alan Roth's article he mentioned the http://easy48.com/sedt/ web > page and it still exists. Some days ago I sent an e-mail to Lee at > the address he gives on that page but so far there has been no reply. > > > As someone who started out on VMS back in 1983 and got used to > programming DCL and using EDT, I have never got used to vi on Solaris > after my company moved to Sun machines around 1996. > > > Do any of you people who read this newsgroup know: > > 1) is the SEDT source available somewhere on the Internet for download > (Google search didn't turn up anything)? > > or > > 2) is there SEDT Solaris binary available (I know this is a VMS > newsgroup!)? > > Thanks > > > Paul McIlfatrick SEDT, now there are some memories. That was my editor of choice on my Rainbow 100+ (a sturdy machine that lived for more than a decade before expiring). violins please ... Anyway, what is the best choice for a free "windows" editor with a fully functional EDT interface (incl. macros) ? I do not work in the VMS world anymore, so I am editing on windows and I admit that I miss TPU/EDT. cheers Dweeb ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 07:02:20 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: Looking for SEDT source code Message-ID: <46C974BC.5060107@comcast.net> Dr. Dweeb wrote: > Paul McIlfatrick wrote: > >>Back on 22nd November 2005 Lee Roth posted the following article in >>the comp.unix.solaris newsgroup: >> >> >>>Briefly: I have permission from the original author of SEDT (Anker >>>Berg-Sonne) to make my modified-for-Solaris binary + source files >>>available. >>> >>>If you've never used the DEC EDT editor I certainly don't suggest you >>>begin to do so now, but if you are an old-time DEC user like me that >>>has the EDT editor burned deep into your brain's ROM, you may want to >>>give this powerful EDT-on-steroids editor a look. >>> >>>I had to do a couple of minor tweaks to get the sources to compile, >>>but I have created a binary that runs on Solaris 7, 8 and 9 (Sparc) >>>and a separate binary that (at least) Solaris 7 on Intel platforms. >>>I have not yet tested the binary on Solaris 10 (Sparc). >>> >>>Additional details at http://easy48.com/sedt/ >>> >>>Check out the above link... if interested, please respond to this >>>posting. >>> >>>Thanks, >>> >>>Lee Roth >> >>A few days ago I posted an article to the comp.unix.solaris newsgroup >>asking if Lee Roth had ever made the modified-for-Solaris binary + >>source files available. I got three replies, each trying to be funny >>about painting the numlock key gold. >> >>In Alan Roth's article he mentioned the http://easy48.com/sedt/ web >>page and it still exists. Some days ago I sent an e-mail to Lee at >>the address he gives on that page but so far there has been no reply. >> >> >>As someone who started out on VMS back in 1983 and got used to >>programming DCL and using EDT, I have never got used to vi on Solaris >>after my company moved to Sun machines around 1996. >> >> >>Do any of you people who read this newsgroup know: >> >>1) is the SEDT source available somewhere on the Internet for download >>(Google search didn't turn up anything)? >> >>or >> >>2) is there SEDT Solaris binary available (I know this is a VMS >>newsgroup!)? >> >>Thanks >> >> >>Paul McIlfatrick > > > SEDT, now there are some memories. That was my editor of choice on my > Rainbow 100+ (a sturdy machine that lived for more than a decade before > expiring). violins please ... > > Anyway, what is the best choice for a free "windows" editor with a fully > functional EDT interface (incl. macros) ? > I do not work in the VMS world anymore, so I am editing on windows and I > admit that I miss TPU/EDT. > > cheers > Dweeb > > There used to be a program called EDT+ from Boston Business Computing that ran under DOS. It was expensive! It's the only one I've ever seen or heard of. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 06:15:30 -0700 From: san Subject: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Contract Message-ID: <1187615730.719174.4820@m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com> Hi, This is Santhosh from ECOM Consultants... We have an requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers. Please provide your updated resume ASAP. Number of Positions: 7 positions Duration: 6 - 12 Months Contract to Hire Location: St Louis, MO Project Details: The Client is looking for VMS/C++ Developer. The long term plan will be for all of these individuals to enhance some existing legacy apps that eventually will all be migrated to C++ and the individuals will be retrained in C++. Thanks & Regards, Santhosh Natarajan | Phone 248 436 8451 Ext 209 | Fax 248 430 4456 Email: santhosh@ecomconsultantsinc.com Website: www.ecomconsultantsinc.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 06:28:17 -0700 From: yyyc186 Subject: Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Message-ID: <1187616497.280284.55270@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On Aug 20, 8:15 am, san wrote: > Hi, > > This is Santhosh from ECOM Consultants... > > We have an requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers. Please provide > your updated resume ASAP. > > Number of Positions: 7 positions > > Duration: 6 - 12 Months Contract to Hire > > Location: St Louis, MO You need to post your rate range when posting something like this. Rate blind posts like this waste a lot of qualified people's time by looking to pay less than half the going rate for consultants, especially in St. Louis where a pair of companies think they can bring in 10+ year veterans for $40.00/hr and make them go through full security clearance work up after they are on site. > > Project Details: > > The Client is looking for VMS/C++ Developer. The long term plan will > be for all of these individuals to enhance some existing legacy apps > that eventually will all be migrated to C++ and the individuals will > be retrained in C++. > > Thanks & Regards, > > Santhosh Natarajan | Phone 248 436 8451 Ext 209 | Fax 248 430 4456 > > Email: santh...@ecomconsultantsinc.com Website:www.ecomconsultantsinc.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 08:46:00 -0500 From: "Paul Raulerson" Subject: RE: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Message-ID: <000301c7e330$7308f250$591ad6f0$@com> You know, it would sure be polite to post the rates you are willing to pay, and you policies for handling resumes. I *never* send a resume to a recruiter or consultant company blind; resumes are pretty valuable and I don't want mine to wind up on some huge CD database or something. It also wouldn't hurt to post more about the application domain your client is in. Banking? Insurance? Defense? If you don't post rates and such, it looks an awful lot like you are trolling for resumes. -Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: san [mailto:gem.san@gmail.com] > Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 8:16 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - > 12 Months Contract to Hire > > Hi, > > This is Santhosh from ECOM Consultants... > > We have an requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers. Please provide > your updated resume ASAP. > > Number of Positions: 7 positions > > Duration: 6 - 12 Months Contract to Hire > > Location: St Louis, MO > > Project Details: > > The Client is looking for VMS/C++ Developer. The long term plan will > be for all of these individuals to enhance some existing legacy apps > that eventually will all be migrated to C++ and the individuals will > be retrained in C++. > > Thanks & Regards, > > Santhosh Natarajan | Phone 248 436 8451 Ext 209 | Fax 248 430 4456 > > Email: santhosh@ecomconsultantsinc.com Website: > www.ecomconsultantsinc.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 13:47:56 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Message-ID: In article <1187615730.719174.4820@m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com>, san writes: > > >Hi, > >This is Santhosh from ECOM Consultants... > >We have an requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers. Please provide >your updated resume ASAP. > >Number of Positions: 7 positions > >Duration: 6 - 12 Months Contract to Hire > >Location: St Louis, MO > >Project Details: > >The Client is looking for VMS/C++ Developer. The long term plan will >be for all of these individuals to enhance some existing legacy apps >that eventually will all be migrated to C++ and the individuals will >be retrained in C++. As I read this, there is no current need for C++ as you wrote "the individuals will be retrained in C++". What would be important now would be to know the language that these app are currently authoried with. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 16:14:48 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Message-ID: In article <000301c7e330$7308f250$591ad6f0$@com>, "Paul Raulerson" wrote: > You know, it would sure be polite to post the rates you are willing to pay, > and you policies for handling resumes. I *never* send a resume to a > recruiter or consultant company blind; resumes are pretty valuable and I > don't want > mine to wind up on some huge CD database or something. > > It also wouldn't hurt to post more about the application domain your client > is in. Banking? Insurance? Defense? > > If you don't post rates and such, it looks an awful lot like you are > trolling for resumes. Not to mention the classic head hunting scam of advertising non-existent jobs, with the aim of gathering contacts by asking for references. -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 08:09:17 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Message-ID: On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 06:47:56 -0700, VAXman- <@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote: > In article <1187615730.719174.4820@m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com>, san > writes: >> >> >> Hi, >> >> This is Santhosh from ECOM Consultants... >> >> We have an requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers. Please provide >> your updated resume ASAP. >> >> Number of Positions: 7 positions >> >> Duration: 6 - 12 Months Contract to Hire >> >> Location: St Louis, MO >> >> Project Details: >> >> The Client is looking for VMS/C++ Developer. The long term plan will >> be for all of these individuals to enhance some existing legacy apps >> that eventually will all be migrated to C++ and the individuals will >> be retrained in C++. > > As I read this, there is no current need for C++ as you wrote "the > individuals will be retrained in C++". What would be important now > would be to know the language that these app are currently authoried > with. > VMS management is under the mistaken impression that PL/I code can be readily be translated to C++, and given the aerospace influence there, I would guess that it is PL/I. After all, why would you use C++ unless HP recommended it, and you didn't know better. -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 16:47:37 +0100 From: Elliott Roper Subject: Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Message-ID: <200820071647377670%nospam@yrl.co.uk> In article , Tom Linden wrote: > VMS management is under the mistaken impression that PL/I code can be > readily be translated to C++, and given the aerospace influence > there, I would guess that it is PL/I. After all, why would you use > C++ unless HP recommended it, and you didn't know better. Ah! Two classics in one day! Keep 'em coming Tom! -- To de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$ PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810 E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 18:52:36 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: Requirement looking for VMS/C++ Developers, St Louis, MO, 6 - 12 Months Cont Message-ID: In article , "Tom Linden" wrote: > VMS management is under the mistaken impression that PL/I code can be > readily be translated to C++, and given the aerospace influence there, I > would guess that it is PL/I. After all, why would you use C++ unless > HP recommended it, and you didn't know better. > Hmm. Just over 10 years ago a relation was implementing a laptop solution for a fleet of sales people. When I enquired what they would be using I got the answer "Why, C++, _of course_" It was the "of course" which niggled me, and it took a _lot_ of self control on my part not to rub it in when Y2K turned out to be a nightmare for them. -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:06:21 -0700 From: seotutor Subject: Teach Yourself SAP in 24 Hours Guide ! Message-ID: <1187611581.894615.53910@l22g2000prc.googlegroups.com> >From the basics surrounding SAP, to implementation planning and system navigation, to creating your own SAP reports and using the many different SAP components that make up NetWeaver and mySAP business suite today, this Guide is ideal for people at all levels of education, experience, and familiarity with SAP. http://flying-rugs.com/SAP/in_24_Hours/toc.html ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 07:55:46 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: <$gEKiuHGpvF+@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <1187305619.700116.251090@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Doug Phillips writes: > > Didn't Microsoft use VMS in-house for quite a few years or is my bad > memory just giving search engines a new mis-information link? Often reports and good enough sources to be assumed to be true. If it's not true somebody will have to prove it not. Until then, I'll believe it is true. MS had to have an accounting system long before they even dreamed of making up WNT based server farms. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 13:14:04 +0000 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: RE: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul Raulerson [mailto:paul@raulersons.com] > Sent: August 19, 2007 8:33 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: RE: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal > champion > > [snip] > > Actually, it is very common to "app stack" under UNIX of all flavors, > mostly > because that is exactly what you > are doing with all kinds of servers such as web servers, ftp servers, > e-mail > servers, etc. User applications also tend to run very well, as they are > not > capable of clobbering each other, memory or process wise. > The common stuff designed for multiple users (FTP, Web, Email etc) is one t= hing, but placing custom and ISV applications written in C, C++, Fortran etc that= were designed as if they had single system (as many were in the old distributed = era) on the same system is another matter. In many cases (primarily Windows/Linux, but a good portion of UNIX as well)= , the ISV will dictate that they only support their App on a dedicated environmen= t. Something else to consider is that a new trend emerging is called "Tier consolidation". Due to the huge glut of available CPU cycles and cheap, hig= h bandwidth networks, companies like SAP are now recommending App servers be = placed on the same server as the DB. You not only eliminate more OS's, but also re= duce the delays in the overall solution that was due to network latencies (as mo= st know here the diff between a network IO and a direct IO is an order of magnitude= ). One could argue that you can also increase security in this way as well. Within the next 12-24 months, the industry is going to see a whole lot more= of this type of activity. [snip] Regards Kerry Main Senior Consultant HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660 Fax: 613-591-4477 kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT) OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 08:00:22 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Write locked file Message-ID: In article <13c8k7978crk67b@corp.supernews.com>, "Mike Minor" writes: > I have a situation where a .txt file is in a write locked state What do you mean be "write locked"? Lots of things can prevent you from writing to a file other than its being open. Is your system in a cluster? If so then you should know that "show device/files" only shows the files opened by the node you're on. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 2007 07:53:13 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: X Window Servers Message-ID: <9oZxojY6KJRn@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article , "Brian Tillman" writes: > > I have no idea what "bash" is. I don't know what "cygwin startx" is. bash is the "Bourne-again shell". It's the usual shell interface to cygwin, although other shells are available. startx is a shell script for starting the X11 server under cygwin. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 04:47:04 -0700 From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: You know you've been around VMS too long when... Message-ID: <1187610424.122782.227020@r34g2000hsd.googlegroups.com> On Aug 19, 11:52 pm, "winston19842...@yahoo.com" wrote: > your 6 year old son threatens to spank your 3 year old daughter, and > you tell him "You aren't allowed to spank her - you don't have OPER > priv." Winston, Purely as an "academic"" exercise (smile), and not taking a position for or against corporal punishment, OPER would not be appropriate. GRPPRV would probably be appropriate (GRPPRV would allow spanking a member of your group). OPER would allow the spanking of any child within the security domain. This metaphorical example should not be taken too far, the implications of other privileges (e.g. GROUP and WORLD) are clearly out of bounds. - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.456 ************************