INFO-VAX Thu, 13 Nov 2008 Volume 2008 : Issue 614 Contents: Re: AlphaServer 8400 for Trade Re: AlphaServer 8400 for Trade Re: AlphaServer 8400 for Trade Re: Emulation RE: Emulation Re: Emulation RE: Emulation Re: Fortran, debugger and Alpha/VMS 7.3-2 Re: Good news: HP has retaken the VMS trademark ! Re: Most impressive VAX installations Re: Most impressive VAX installations Re: Most impressive VAX installations Re: Most impressive VAX installations Re: Peek&Spy anyone ? Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Re: Submit to run at 01:05 after EDT becomes EST Re: VAX-11/785 microdiagnostics help requested ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 22:23:12 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: AlphaServer 8400 for Trade Message-ID: In article , vaxorcist writes: > I will trade off my AlphaServer 8400 for a VAX-11/750. I guess the power consumption will stay about the same. The VAX is 1 VUP, right? The 8400 must be about 1500. Not a judgement, just an observation. While I don't have such big machines at home, I can appreciate the joy of running a VAX (of which I have several, all small and relatively fast (for VAXes). ------------------------------ Date: 13 Nov 2008 00:03:16 +0100 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOeGER) Subject: Re: AlphaServer 8400 for Trade Message-ID: <491b6ec4$1@news.langstoeger.at> In article , helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes: >The VAX is 1 VUP, right? Nope. The 11/780 was (per definition) 1 VUP. The 11/750 was well below (0,7) -- Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTÖGER Network and OpenVMS system specialist E-mail Peter@LANGSTOeGER.at A-1030 VIENNA AUSTRIA I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2008 07:32:24 +0100 From: Wilm Boerhout Subject: Re: AlphaServer 8400 for Trade Message-ID: <491bca14$0$8587$ba620dc5@nova.planet.nl> Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply vaguely mentioned on 12-11-2008 23:23: > In article > , > vaxorcist writes: > >> I will trade off my AlphaServer 8400 for a VAX-11/750. > > I guess the power consumption will stay about the same. > > The VAX is 1 VUP, right? The 8400 must be about 1500. Not a judgement, > just an observation. While I don't have such big machines at home, I > can appreciate the joy of running a VAX (of which I have several, all > small and relatively fast (for VAXes). Alpha's don't count VUPs, see (a.o.) http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/performance/vups_297.html If you still want to compare, from Table 1 on that page, I infer that the (SPECxxx) performance of an Alphaserver 8400 5/300 is roughly 10 times a VAX 7000-610, or 350 VUPs. YMMV. /Wilm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 11:02:56 -0800 (PST) From: Peter Weaver Subject: Re: Emulation Message-ID: <05919159-ab83-4652-ae25-63dd2a6debe5@1g2000prd.googlegroups.com> On Nov 12, 1:03=A0pm, "Tom Linden" wrote: > On Wed, 12 Nov 2008 05:20:14 -0800, IanMiller wrote: > > the current HP words on this are at > >http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/sri-charon-vax-emulator.html > > Ian, I once called HP and they could not find the part number that is > listed on that page, QP-6KQAA-AA > > -- > PL/I for OpenVMSwww.kednos.com That happens, call again or ask to speak to a manager. A few months ago a customer of mine was trying to buy the transfer license for two new CHARON systems they bought and they were told several times that the part number did not exist. This particular customer already had 16 transfer licenses from CHARON systems they bought over the past 4 years so they knew the part number was valid. After half a dozen or so phone calls they finally found a person who knew how to type the part number into their system. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:37:39 +0000 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: RE: Emulation Message-ID: <9D02E14BC0A2AE43A5D16A4CD8EC5A593ED9777477@GVW1158EXB.americas.hpqcorp.net> > -----Original Message----- > From: Wilm Boerhout [mailto:w6.boerhout@planet.nl] > Sent: November 12, 2008 12:11 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: Re: Emulation > > Main, Kerry vaguely mentioned on 11-11-2008 22:34: > > [snip] > > I have more than 20 years experience with designing and quoting VAX and > Alpha solutions. Although (or because?) I'm currently a CHARON > reseller, > I'm still a professional. My quotes always take the workload into > account, and contain the full hardware, software and (transfer) license > and service costs. My customers tell me in *all* cases, the payback > time > is way under 18 months by *their* accounting standards. Why should I > tell you otherwise? (Mind you, I'm in Europe. YMMV). Second hand VAX or > Alpha is hardly an option here (We have no Island Computers lookalike, > so David, if you'd like to go international...). Itanium migation is > *always* perceived as too expensive. > > And Kerry, could you set things straight about the CHARON Transfer > licenses (not) being used for SIMH? It was never the intention, but > should I assume another position on this issue? IMO the transfer > licenses are for CHARON platforms only. > > /Wilm Wilm, The issues I raised were generic and not pointed at any individual. As far as "Itanium migrations always being too expensive", while that might be the case for Cust's without the source or code that contains a lot of low level arch specific code, or App that is about to retire, but that is certainly not the case for many other Customers. That blanket statement is another example of why I get so cranky when Cust's are presented with options that have not been properly researched. Heck, there were some Cust's that ported the majority of their code during the 3 day porting workshops held earlier. And this was done on entry level Itanium servers that they received free with the workshop. And btw, I do not pretend to be a license guru, so will leave that for others more familiar with the issues. Regards Kerry Main Senior Consultant HP Services Canada Voice: 613-254-8911 Fax: 613-591-4477 kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT) OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 21:57:56 +0100 From: Wilm Boerhout Subject: Re: Emulation Message-ID: <491b436d$0$8605$ba620dc5@nova.planet.nl> Main, Kerry vaguely mentioned on 12-11-2008 21:37: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Wilm Boerhout [mailto:w6.boerhout@planet.nl] >> Sent: November 12, 2008 12:11 PM >> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >> Subject: Re: Emulation >> >> Main, Kerry vaguely mentioned on 11-11-2008 22:34: >> >> > > [snip] > >> I have more than 20 years experience with designing and quoting VAX and >> Alpha solutions. Although (or because?) I'm currently a CHARON >> reseller, >> I'm still a professional. My quotes always take the workload into >> account, and contain the full hardware, software and (transfer) license >> and service costs. My customers tell me in *all* cases, the payback >> time >> is way under 18 months by *their* accounting standards. Why should I >> tell you otherwise? (Mind you, I'm in Europe. YMMV). Second hand VAX or >> Alpha is hardly an option here (We have no Island Computers lookalike, >> so David, if you'd like to go international...). Itanium migation is >> *always* perceived as too expensive. >> >> And Kerry, could you set things straight about the CHARON Transfer >> licenses (not) being used for SIMH? It was never the intention, but >> should I assume another position on this issue? IMO the transfer >> licenses are for CHARON platforms only. >> >> /Wilm > > Wilm, > > The issues I raised were generic and not pointed at any individual. > > As far as "Itanium migrations always being too expensive", while that > might be the case for Cust's without the source or code that contains > a lot of low level arch specific code, or App that is about to retire, > but that is certainly not the case for many other Customers. > > That blanket statement is another example of why I get so cranky when > Cust's are presented with options that have not been properly > researched. > > Heck, there were some Cust's that ported the majority of their code > during the 3 day porting workshops held earlier. And this was done on > entry level Itanium servers that they received free with the workshop. > > And btw, I do not pretend to be a license guru, so will leave that > for others more familiar with the issues. OK, point taken. Virtualization nor migration is *the* solution. However "porting" in a three day workshop cannot possibly include thorough functional testing of the newly compiled and linked applications. Virtualization with CHARON -seen by our customers as a simple hardware replacement- is seldom more than a few days work, and includes all testing, since HP themselves certify and support the CHARON platform solution as being genuine VAX/Alpha. Down from the soapbox, already! Our customers need both our viewpoints to keep VMS alive for a few more years. Then I'll retire, and you're on your own... /Wilm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 19:42:51 -0500 From: "Stanley F. Quayle" Subject: RE: Emulation Message-ID: <491B31BB.6228.559FCBC@infovax.stanq.com> On 12 Nov 2008 at 15:05, Main, Kerry wrote: > While they may be out of date, I have quotes from Charon re-sellers to > backup the costs I quoted. Other resellers and I don't share pricing, so I wouldn't know. I can only talk about my own price list. > You carefully quoted a 6610 - what about a VAX 6620? VAX 6630? VAX 6660? Not with an intent to deceive. I have a few 6610 installations, and one 6620. Of course, a 6660 would be a lot more expensive. But at 700+ VUP's, faster than any VAX ever built. I just haven't run across anyone that needs that much horsepower (yet!). > so one cannot dismiss this until the target workload is understood. Absolutely. It's unfortunate that many customers don't have useful information about their workload. That would make my life much easier. > Mgmt gets sold on the concept as they know about what it costs in their > Wintel/VMware world. And then the full cost becomes known. Well, my understanding is that VMware doesn't interpret each Intel instruction like we have to do with VAX and Alpha. The misunderstanding gets corrected well before discussing pricing, because I explain why their virtual VAX will not be thousands of times faster on an Intel processor. > The original note stated they needed a solution for only 18 months. One licensing alternative is a one-year license, with a renewal 12 months out. It just breaks even if they keep CHARON-VAX for 3 years, so it would definitely be cheaper. > How many Cust's would go to their Mgmt to spend $100K on an App environment > that is expected to be gone in 18 months? Depends on how critical it is. If their downtime costs are many many kilobucks per hour, it might be justified. This customer is definitely on the edge of reasonableness. > IT manager is usually "concerned" about electrical costs, but that is > not something that impacts his / her budget directly. Depends on whether that $100,000 check can be cut by the IT manager, or whether it goes up to the CEO, who might have a broader picture. > What I always recommend is Cust's should understand the whole picture > before making any commitments. Amen! --Stan Quayle Quayle Consulting Inc. ---------- Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ Toll free: 1-888-I-LUV-VAX 8572 North Spring Ct., Pickerington, OH 43147 USA stan-at-stanq-dot-com http://www.stanq.com/charon-vax.html "OpenVMS, when downtime is not an option" ------------------------------ Date: 13 Nov 2008 05:27:09 GMT From: "David Weatherall" Subject: Re: Fortran, debugger and Alpha/VMS 7.3-2 Message-ID: <6o1s5dF1emrcU1@mid.individual.net> David Weatherall wrote: > My only problem, now is that my command file that builds my > application fails when Fortran-77 (V7.5) compiling my source with > "/DEBUG". No /NOOPT. GEM whinges about GSD errors. I can't quote the > precise error text 'cos I sent the mail with above information before > finding the problem... > > I can't check what else the SM changed 'cos he's on a well-earned > holiday and I've no desire to disturb him. I still debug on VAX so I > can live with whatever side-effect of the DEBUG fix might be causing > the compiler problem. I suspect compiling individual modules with get > around it. ie.. > > FOR /deb /sep mod1 > FOR /deb /sep mod2 > . . . > FOR /deb /sep modn > > instead of > > FOR /deb /sep - > ! > mod1,- > mod2,- > . . . > modn > > as I've had similar problems in the past in another app, All coincidence, as half expected. I'd added a couple of fields to a structure in an INCLUDEd file and it takes the symbol table handling over the edge again. We will upgrade the Fortran compiler before the next major revision of our s/w. :) Cheers - Dave -- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 22:29:08 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: Good news: HP has retaken the VMS trademark ! Message-ID: In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article <6d5b0$472b798b$cef8887a$5047@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei writes: > > > > In this case, it is moot. Just as the case for the use of "ALL-IN-1" for > > its printers, HP can use "VMS" for whatever it wants since it owns the > > company that owned that trademark. > > Actually it didn't. HP owns "OpenVMS" but the VMS trademark was > allowed to expire before VMS bought Compaq. There are now other > software systems trademarked as "VMS" which would prevent HP > from using "VMS" as a software trademark, unless they first track > down and purchase that from the current owner. I think only if there is possibility of confusion, such as another OS called VMS. I don't know if application software would be deemed close enough to an OS to cause confusion. There was Apple Computer and Apple Records---no problem, until the former started to deal in music. There is a vacuum cleaner called the VAX (made famous by the magazine ad "nothing sucks like a VAX"). The German Stock Exchange has some software called Eurex; that name is also used for a mark of trousers (and, I believe, for Venetian blinds or something similar). (Maybe Oliver Sacks has written a book about the man who mistook his software for trousers or vice versa, but that's not a mistake a healthy person would make, except perhaps someone who programs by the seat of his pants. On the other hand, "software" and "underwear" are linguistically rather close. I won't talk about hardware in this respect, much less firmware or wetware.) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 22:34:18 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: Most impressive VAX installations Message-ID: In article , moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) writes: > Not a single system, but I came across comments in the disk shadowing code > for a bugfix where a byte field was being treated as a negative number > if it exceeded 127. That byte field was the number of nodes in a cluster, > and it was found by a customer (I think I know who), not internal testing. > > Also the test followed a decrement of that field, meaning a node left the > cluster, so the bug wouldn't have been seen unless there were 129 or > more nodes in the cluster at some point. (Supported limit was/is 96) As you point out, there are reasons why that's the supported limit. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 22:39:48 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: Most impressive VAX installations Message-ID: In article , Michael Kraemer writes: > Found a historical quote (as of 1990): > 2x4MB for a VS3176 for close to 3000 DEM (approx $1500 back then). > And that's already the cheaper OEM price, not the original DEC one. > I think VS4000 memory wasn't that much cheaper. I remember pricing RISC machines about 1994 or so. We figured on roughly DM 100 per MB. Today, a 4-GB memory card for a digital camera costs about EUR 10. Factor 20,000 in 14 years. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 17:36:21 -0800 (PST) From: johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk Subject: Re: Most impressive VAX installations Message-ID: <3c395fbc-074b-419b-9562-482b0b6fe958@q9g2000yqc.googlegroups.com> On Nov 12, 10:39=A0pm, hel...@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig--- remove CLOTHES to reply) wrote: > In article , Michael Kraemer > > writes: > > Found a historical quote (as of 1990): > > 2x4MB for a VS3176 for close to 3000 DEM (approx $1500 back then). > > And that's already the cheaper OEM price, not the original DEC one. > > I think VS4000 memory wasn't that much cheaper. > > I remember pricing RISC machines about 1994 or so. =A0We figured on > roughly DM 100 per MB. =A0Today, a 4-GB memory card for a digital camera > costs about EUR 10. =A0Factor 20,000 in 14 years. Memory has indeed got a lot cheaper, but you're comparing flash memory for a digital camera with memory for a server, which generally makes little sense. For 4GB of server memory (buffered, ECC) I'd expect to pay very roughly $150 from someone like Kingston, or a bit more (but maybe not the huge amount more which some people may be thinking) if you want a Compaq-badged "original" part. Not quite so recent memory (eg PC100 buffered ECC memory) might well cost you closer to $1000 for 4GB in eight 512KB sticks;older memory is starting to get expensive again. Same goes for older camera memory too; I'm still using SmartMedia in mine; 128MB is EUR20 or so (and a year or so ago, it seemed worryingly like it had actually become unavailable). Meanwhile a Windows licence isn't noticeably cheaper today than it was when Win3.11 first came out in the mid 90s [1] (around $100 or so?), and if you want today's "high end" non-cut-down Windows, it's substantially *more* expensive than in the early days, especially for any individuals foolish enough to pay full retail (Vista Ultimate GBP230) rather than OEM (Vista Ultimate GBP120). Is that impressive, or what? Pedantically yours, John [1] http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7707016.stm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2008 02:49:27 +0000 (UTC) From: legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) Subject: Re: Most impressive VAX installations Message-ID: [Please do not mail me a copy of your followup] johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk spake the secret code <3c395fbc-074b-419b-9562-482b0b6fe958@q9g2000yqc.googlegroups.com> thusly: >Meanwhile a Windows licence isn't noticeably cheaper today than it was >when Win3.11 first came out in the mid 90s [1] (around $100 or so?), This is as silly as the memory comparison. You're not buying a Win 3.11 license when you put out that $100 today. You're getting a *lot* more software and functionality for that same $100. Remember that 3.11 doesn't even include TCP/IP. -- "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download Legalize Adulthood! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 18:22:52 -0500 From: "Tom Simpson" Subject: Re: Peek&Spy anyone ? Message-ID: I used the Raxco product for years and worked fine for most everything. However, one thing it did have a problem with was FMS screens, which was what our main application used. When monitoring, you could see everything that the user saw except what was on the screen before you started your monitoring session (which is logical). A control-w would not force the FMS graphics to refresh. If the user moved off the screen to a different screen, you would see everything. It was an aggravation but not a show-stopper. The Peek&Spy product handled the monitoring task much differently could display what was on the user's FMS screen before you started your monitor session (claimed the vendor). This additional functionality significantly increased the resources required to run the application (from my discussions with the vendor). Unfortunately, I changed jobs before I actually had a chance to install and test the Peek&Spy product, but it sounded like would solve the one issue we had with Raxco's product. Regards, Tom "Jan-Erik Söderholm" wrote in message news:Uy3Sk.3976$U5.25985@newsb.telia.net... > Hi. > Anyone used Peek&Spy from "Networking Dynamics Corporation" ? > Any comments on the product ? > > http://networkingdynamics.com/Peek.htm > > Jan-Erik. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 13:48:44 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Message-ID: <000cfd28$0$9227$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> Rob wrote: > You could easily trace the port to your SMTP server to see how VMS is > sending the message. $DEFINE/SYSTEM TCPIP$SMTP_SYMB_TRACE 1 $TCPIP STOP MAIL $WAIT 00:00:30 $TCPIP START MAIL The symbiont logfile will now contain the actual dialogue between itself and remoce SMTP server, and you will clearly see the RCPT TO: commands and will know if the VMS server is sending a copy of message to multiple recipients in the same domain or whether it is sending one copy per recipient. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 15:48:50 -0800 (PST) From: Rich Jordan Subject: Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Message-ID: <209b964c-485c-4c7e-9875-dbc9c6469a72@q26g2000prq.googlegroups.com> On Nov 12, 12:48=A0pm, JF Mezei wrote: > Rob wrote: > > You could easily trace the port to your SMTP server to see how VMS is > > sending the message. > > $DEFINE/SYSTEM TCPIP$SMTP_SYMB_TRACE 1 > $TCPIP STOP MAIL > $WAIT 00:00:30 > $TCPIP START MAIL > > The symbiont logfile will now contain the actual dialogue between itself > and remoce SMTP server, and you will clearly see the RCPT TO: commands > and will know if the VMS server is sending a copy of message to > multiple recipients in the same domain or whether it is sending one copy > per recipient. Actually you should monitor your SMTP queues and make sure they're all stopped before restarting mail. Although a 30 second wait maybe enough, I've been bitten a couple of times by a system with 4 SMTP queues where the last queue would not stop for nearly 75 seconds. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 17:12:25 -0700 From: "Michael D. Ober" Subject: Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Message-ID: "JF Mezei" wrote in message news:000cfd28$0$9227$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com... > Rob wrote: > >> You could easily trace the port to your SMTP server to see how VMS is >> sending the message. > > > $DEFINE/SYSTEM TCPIP$SMTP_SYMB_TRACE 1 > $TCPIP STOP MAIL > $WAIT 00:00:30 > $TCPIP START MAIL > > > The symbiont logfile will now contain the actual dialogue between itself > and remoce SMTP server, and you will clearly see the RCPT TO: commands > and will know if the VMS server is sending a copy of message to > multiple recipients in the same domain or whether it is sending one copy > per recipient. > I'll try that this evening after everyone is off the system. I did try a manual session where I telnetted to port 25 of the Exchange server and put in multiple domains in the RCPT TO: fields and only a single message was sent (and journelled). Mike. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:31:24 -0700 From: "Michael D. Ober" Subject: Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Message-ID: "Michael D. Ober" wrote in message news:eYmdnbX1Lohx7YbUnZ2dnUVZ_jmdnZ2d@earthlink.com... > "JF Mezei" wrote in message > news:000cfd28$0$9227$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com... >> Rob wrote: >> >>> You could easily trace the port to your SMTP server to see how VMS is >>> sending the message. >> >> >> $DEFINE/SYSTEM TCPIP$SMTP_SYMB_TRACE 1 >> $TCPIP STOP MAIL >> $WAIT 00:00:30 >> $TCPIP START MAIL >> >> >> The symbiont logfile will now contain the actual dialogue between itself >> and remoce SMTP server, and you will clearly see the RCPT TO: commands >> and will know if the VMS server is sending a copy of message to >> multiple recipients in the same domain or whether it is sending one copy >> per recipient. >> > > > I'll try that this evening after everyone is off the system. I did try a > manual session where I telnetted to port 25 of the Exchange server and put > in multiple domains in the RCPT TO: fields and only a single message was > sent (and journelled). > > Mike. > OK - I ran the commands above and entered the following: SYSTEM>mail MAIL> send To: mdo@wakeassoc.com,obermd@alum.mit.edu,obermd@sprintmail.com Subj: test 2 from VMS Mail program Enter your message below. Press CTRL/Z when complete, or CTRL/C to quit: Three addresses; work; public home; private home Exit MAIL> exit Here's the log file: %%%%%%%%%%%% 12-NOV-2008 20:21:46.27 %%%%%%%%%%%% %TCPIP-I-SMTP_SYMBRUN, symbiont is running the queue TCPIP$SMTP_JAGUAR_01 recv buf=220 apollo.wakeassoc.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: 6.0.3790.3959 ready at Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:20:30 -0700 \0d\0a send buf=HELO jaguar.wakeassoc.com\0d\0a recv buf=250 apollo.wakeassoc.com Hello [...]\0d\0a send buf=MAIL FROM:\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.1.0 system@wakeassoc.com....Sender OK\0d\0a send buf=RCPT TO:\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.1.5 MDO@wakeassoc.com \0d\0a send buf=DATA\0d\0a recv buf=354 Start mail input; end with .\0d\0a send buf=Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:22:07 -0700 (MST)\0d\0a send buf=Message-Id: <08111220220772_384A7@wakeassoc.com>\0d\0a send buf=From: system@wakeassoc.com\0d\0a send buf=To: MDO@wakeassoc.com, OBERMD@alum.mit.edu, OBERMD@sprintmail.com\0d\0a send buf=Subject: test 3\0d\0a send buf=X-VMS-To: MDO@WAKEASSOC.COM, OBERMD@ALUM.MIT.EDU, OBERMD@SPRINTMAIL.COM\0d\0a send buf=\0d\0a send buf=three addresses to different domains\0d\0a send buf=.\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.6.0 <08111220220772_384A7@wakeassoc.com> Queued mail for delivery\0d\0a send buf=QUIT\0d\0a recv buf=221 2.0.0 apollo.wakeassoc.com Service closing transmission channel\0d\0a recv buf=220 apollo.wakeassoc.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: 6.0.3790.3959 ready at Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:20:32 -0700 \0d\0a send buf=HELO jaguar.wakeassoc.com\0d\0a recv buf=250 apollo.wakeassoc.com Hello [...]\0d\0a send buf=MAIL FROM:\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.1.0 system@wakeassoc.com....Sender OK\0d\0a send buf=RCPT TO:\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.1.5 OBERMD@alum.mit.edu \0d\0a send buf=DATA\0d\0a recv buf=354 Start mail input; end with .\0d\0a send buf=Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:22:07 -0700 (MST)\0d\0a send buf=Message-Id: <08111220220772_384A7@wakeassoc.com>\0d\0a send buf=From: system@wakeassoc.com\0d\0a send buf=To: MDO@wakeassoc.com, OBERMD@alum.mit.edu, OBERMD@sprintmail.com\0d\0a send buf=Subject: test 3\0d\0a send buf=X-VMS-To: MDO@WAKEASSOC.COM, OBERMD@ALUM.MIT.EDU, OBERMD@SPRINTMAIL.COM\0d\0a send buf=\0d\0a send buf=three addresses to different domains\0d\0a send buf=.\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.6.0 <08111220220772_384A7@wakeassoc.com> Queued mail for delivery\0d\0a send buf=QUIT\0d\0a recv buf=221 2.0.0 apollo.wakeassoc.com Service closing transmission channel\0d\0a recv buf=220 apollo.wakeassoc.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: 6.0.3790.3959 ready at Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:20:33 -0700 \0d\0a send buf=HELO jaguar.wakeassoc.com\0d\0a recv buf=250 apollo.wakeassoc.com Hello [...]\0d\0a send buf=MAIL FROM:\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.1.0 system@wakeassoc.com....Sender OK\0d\0a send buf=RCPT TO:\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.1.5 OBERMD@sprintmail.com \0d\0a send buf=DATA\0d\0a recv buf=354 Start mail input; end with .\0d\0a send buf=Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:22:07 -0700 (MST)\0d\0a send buf=Message-Id: <08111220220772_384A7@wakeassoc.com>\0d\0a send buf=From: system@wakeassoc.com\0d\0a send buf=To: MDO@wakeassoc.com, OBERMD@alum.mit.edu, OBERMD@sprintmail.com\0d\0a send buf=Subject: test 3\0d\0a send buf=X-VMS-To: MDO@WAKEASSOC.COM, OBERMD@ALUM.MIT.EDU, OBERMD@SPRINTMAIL.COM\0d\0a send buf=\0d\0a send buf=three addresses to different domains\0d\0a send buf=.\0d\0a recv buf=250 2.6.0 <08111220220772_384A7@wakeassoc.com> Queued mail for delivery\0d\0a send buf=QUIT\0d\0a recv buf=221 2.0.0 apollo.wakeassoc.com Service closing transmission channel\0d\0a %%%%%%%%%%%% 12-NOV-2008 20:23:00.55 %%%%%%%%%%%% %TCPIP-I-SMTP_SYMBSTOP, symbiont is stopped There is a message generated by VMS for each recipient mail domain. What I need to do is have VMS send the entire message to all mail domains in the address list in a single session. When I have tested multiple recipients in a single domain, they are sent in a single message. Mike. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:56:30 -0700 From: Glen Herrmannsfeldt Subject: Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Message-ID: Michael D. Ober wrote: (snip) > I'll try that this evening after everyone is off the system. I did try > a manual session where I telnetted to port 25 of the Exchange server and > put in multiple domains in the RCPT TO: fields and only a single message > was sent (and journelled). All on one line, or separate RCPT TO: lines? (I don't think I ever tried, though.) -- glen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 22:49:09 -0700 From: "Michael D. Ober" Subject: Re: SFF (Send From File) Utility Message-ID: <5tadndf5trFFIobUnZ2dnUVZ_h-dnZ2d@earthlink.com> "Glen Herrmannsfeldt" wrote in message news:gfg8j9$9ne$1@aioe.org... > Michael D. Ober wrote: > (snip) > >> I'll try that this evening after everyone is off the system. I did try a >> manual session where I telnetted to port 25 of the Exchange server and >> put in multiple domains in the RCPT TO: fields and only a single message >> was sent (and journelled). > > All on one line, or separate RCPT TO: lines? > (I don't think I ever tried, though.) > > -- glen > > You can only put a single address per RCPT TO:. You can enter multiple RCPT TO lines. Take a look at the script and logs I received. It appears that it's the SMPT symbiont that is splitting the message. Mike. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 22:20:15 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: Submit to run at 01:05 after EDT becomes EST Message-ID: In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > Subject: Re: Submit to run at 01:05 after EDT becomes EST It's late, and I'm catching up after more than 3 weeks in hospital, and I posted a question about EDT today, so I parsed the subject wrongly. If MY BELOVED EDT were to suddenly change its identity in the middle of the night, then I think I would also submit myself to run! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 12:12:12 -0800 (PST) From: iking@killthewabbit.org Subject: Re: VAX-11/785 microdiagnostics help requested Message-ID: <84808974-373d-487a-b0aa-8d4d3914a1e7@w1g2000prk.googlegroups.com> Progress: I've determined that the microdiagnostic monitor loads into LSI-11 memory just fine. However, its first block is all zeros - I've verified in the listing that this is correct. So it loads a block of zeros at 70000 (octal), with a jump instruction into the code at 71000. After loading this file, the console jumps to 70000, where of course it halts. I note that the value in R1 is 70000. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? I've also tried loading the diagnostic supervisor. This wasn't working. Then, while digging into the engineering drawings, I realized that the TOY clock gets its power from the battery backup unit, whether or not its batteries work (which, after all these years, ours don't). Contrast this with any given MicroVAX, where the battery backup is just that, and if the machine is powered up the TOY is powered off the internal mains. Not on a VAX-11/78x.... After reconnecting the BBU, I can successfully load and run the DS, and the VAX autosizer reports all my devices - hooray! But I'd still like to run some diagnostics.... Does anyone out there have a copy of RX8 from the VAX-11 diag set (also known as AS-E161N-DF), and RX25, AS-F748H-DE? I would be incredibly grateful if someone can share a copy with me. I can restore a disk image, or would be happy to pay for shipping both ways of a couple of floppies for copying. I really want to run some serious diagnostics on these olde beastes before launching into a VMS install.... Thanks -- Ian Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change. Ian King - iking@killthewabbit.org ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2008.614 ************************